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Discussion Starter #1
Not wanting to be left holding the PR bag, Honda decides to issue a press release on the new Honda Pilot . . .

http://hondanews.com/Forms/corp/*ws4d-db-query-Show.ws4d?*ws4d-db-query-Show***001742***-wieck_media***-***corp(directory)***.ws4d?corp/results(r)_text.html
 

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i fixed the link

I fixed the link:

Click here
 

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Discussion Starter #4
More Pics

Thanks fellow Penn Stater for fixing the link.

Here are yet more picture links . . .

Pic #1

Pic #2

Pic #3

Pic #4


Learn something new everyday
 

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Re: i fixed the link

davegood said:
I fixed the link:

Click here
Nice info. It looks like an MDX cousin but the engine and design spec sounds more like to compete with other full 4-wheel drive SUVs.
 

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Looking at the pictures, it all makes sense. You'd expect the similarities to the MDX. Dash looks different, not surprising since you figure they'd remove the trip computer as a way to create a lower price point. Fabric interior with available leather is likely.

I bet the engine will be the the MDX's current engine, or, more likely, the Odyssey's current engine that runs on regular fuel. That works for the Honda lineup, and Honda is not shy about putting power in the larger vehicles (and since the Pilot will probably be bigger than the MDX, it'll need the power).

Then the 2003 MDX, released several months later, will probably get that long-anticipated power boost. Some may think that Honda wouldn't put that much power in the Pilot when the 2002 MDX is still out, but heck, the 2002 Odyssey now has about as much power, runs on regular, and has some nice options like the DVD entertainment system. I think they'll just upgrade the MDX later, much like the TL and TL-S surpass the RL in certain ways.

I was curious how they might achieve "8 passenger" seating. I didn't think that adding 8" of length (more or less the rumor) was enough to put the third-row seats away from the wheel wells and get width. It seems like they're raised the (still very snug) third row to get some of the width necessary for three people sitting abreast. The rear tailgate does look pretty high so maybe the vehicle is taller from floor to ceiling, letting them raise the third row without sacrificing too much headroom. Not sure how it makes the third-row disappear easier, however.

Of course, that's just a sketch and the final version will be somewhat different.

Should be a good vehicle, as recent Honda/Acuras have been, and certainly a worthwhile choice to consider.
 

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this thing looks pretty big, i guess it is going to be the size of a Tahoe after all.

I'm not sure if i like the front end, but then again these are just sketches. I will wait to reserve final judgement.
 

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another waiting time story?

Just like MDX wonderfully filling the needs of a under-served segment of the luxary SUV market, this Honda cousin will fit another area of the SUV business ... perhaps for people who does not like American made Suburban yet need 8 seaters, with some MDX high-end, yet less luxary and lots of horse power.

I wonder how long the wait this one will be?

:rolleyes:
 

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Discussion Starter #10
wmquan said:
I was curious how they might achieve "8 passenger" seating. I didn't think that adding 8" of length (more or less the rumor) was enough to put the third-row seats away from the wheel wells and get width.

William, I completely agree with your assessment, but with regard to the third row, I fully expect it really is a two seater being marketed as a three seater for kids only - like the Expedition and Durango. On the width, an MDX with square dimensions and a bit of tweaking could handle 3 kids.

A few quotes from the release I found interesting:

"including the largest passenger and cargo hauling capacity in its class"

First what class, Tahoe, Durango, Explorer. I am guessing Durango size with additional width, but comparisons are against Explorer companions. The cargo hauling claim seems to be an easy and big win. Square off the MDX and add 5-8" (I think 5-6") you you easily add 10-12 cubic feet. A 90 cubic feet cargo capacity with second and third rows flat will look really great in the marketing dept.

"Featuring classic SUV proportions . . .a widest-in-class wheel track"

READ - As square as an Tahoe, but we are comapring against an Explorer


Yet another article, slightly interesting if only because the lead engineer was quoted providing some different rumors than we have heard here.

Click Here
 

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Doug, remember all the fun we had speculating on what the MDX was actually going to be like?

I wonder if Honda still considers the Pilot a "mid-sized" SUV as opposed to a "large" SUV. That would make the expected cargo and passenger room for the Pilot indeed the best in its class, though some will argue it's not mid-sized. But there are just so many classifications, such as the EPA ones that go by GVWR (and as such put vehicles like the X5 and ML320 in the "large" class vs. the "medium" MDX).

I'm sure I'm not the only one who finds it ironic that the company that built its fortune on small, light vehicles has "supersized" its three large vehicles (Odyssey, MDX, Pilot) relative to the competition. E.g. the Odyssey was big (and powerful) when it came out, relative to the Sienna, the non-extended Caravan, etc. The MDX is big (and powerful) compared to its director competitors, and the Pilot is going the same way. (Big = passenger + cargo capacity, powerful = basic horsepower and acceleration even if towing isn't necessarily there.)

While some may bemoan the lack of a smaller, sleeker vehicle, I think it's smart marketing in the U.S. Their target market covers a lot of young and growing families and the "bigger is better" mantra often works for those buyers.
 

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i wonder how much it will weigh. If it weighs similar to the MDX then i can understand going with the same V-6, but most tahoe, expedition size vehicles are 5000+lbs. this means that they require a V-8(something honda doesnot have in its arsenal).

Personally, I luv the Toyota Sequoia, but for a non luxury SUV, their price can get out of hand($45,000).

btw, any new reports on prices?

my 2 cents.
 

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I think one problem they will have with the people in the Tahoe size market is towing capacity. It sounds like it will have the same towing capacity as the MDX.

I think price will be in the mid $30s. Honda will be competitively priced to the compitition so that makes is possible to get into the mid $30s.
 

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Discussion Starter #14
wmquan said:
Doug, remember all the fun we had speculating on what the MDX was actually going to be like?

Dave here, not Doug - I have not posted in a long, long time so I understand the name mix up. It was fun guessing on the MDX and even more fun after the prototype teaser in Detroit. The wait for the production version at the NYC Show seemed to take FOREVER. The Pilot specualtion is not nearly as interesting - we have been drving it for over a year ;) ;) I still remember wishing the MDX would have been 5 inches longer back in Arpil 2000 when the stats were released. Looks like I might get my wish, just a little different package . . .

The bigger is better mantra certainly works great if you can keep the MPG respectable as Honda has. I am looking forward to see how the MDX and Pilot are set apart. I know the differentiation will be better than the RX-300/Highlander, but how much better?

For instance, I expect the third row in the Pilot will be one piece - all or nothing like the Explorer. The dash board you mentioned, square verse sleek exterior. But after that, what's left?? Not much.
 

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Power --

It may not be a requirement for Honda to make the Pilot as quick (acceleration-wise) as the MDX. After all, the MDX has better acceleration than all of its direct competitors to begin with. Thus, even if the Pilot is a couple of hundred pounds heavier, they can put the MDX engine -- or, more likely, the Odyssey engine -- into the Pilot and get a good-for-the-class acceleration.

Dave --

Ouch, I'm very sorry about munging your real first name. For some reason that's what stuck in my head for your initials.

Yes, speculating isn't quite as fun when you're not really interested in buying the vehicle (not that it's not going to be a good vehicle, but like you said, we got our MDX's now!).

I agree that the differentiation may not be very large. When the Acura TL was introduced its differentiation from the Accord EX V6 was primary in the trim, slight body differences, more power, the sportshift, xenons, auto climate control, and available nav system. There were a lot of arguments over whether to go with an Accord EX V6 or a TL, especially back then when the TL commanded MSRP.

The Pilot will have the different trim, body differences, quite probably different power results, and just be plain bigger. It may be that Honda will consider that enough to start with, and add upgrades to the MDX (e.g. the rumored upgraded engine to give it higher performance, maybe xenons one of these centuries, maybe VSA, etc.).

I'm not sure what else Honda would do to differentiate it. Dropping auto climate control wouldn't make sense because the Odyssey has it. Dropping the front/rear individual separate controls would be bad in a vehicle even slightly bigger than the MDX, but that's a possibility to cut its cost (e.g. just put vents in the back).

I suspect what'll happen is that the price difference between the two won't be huge, and there'll be countless threads debating which is the best value. Unfortunately for a lot of people (but not all) the difference between Honda and Acura dealership service won't be as pronounced as the difference between Toyota and Lexus.
 

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most tahoe, expedition size vehicles are 5000+lbs. this means that they require a V-8(something honda have in their arsenal).
If it is a V8, I hope its a Honda engine. It scared me a little to read about Honda / GM swapping some engines... yikes
 

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Compare to MDX

This rendering looks much more realistic than the European sketches because of the apparent similarities to the MDX. The plastic undercladding is a sure giveaway of the relationship. Other than the rear roofline, It doesn't look bigger to me (especially not Tahoe-sized)

Does anyone have a better guess of the price positioning? (I read a mid-$30's price, but that seems way high) Will the base be only FWD? I'm guessing that they'll position it to compete with the FWD Highlander at the base price of $23K or so. But, with all the options (AWD, sunroof, AC, CD, Leather, homelink, etc.), It'll be a couple grand less than a comparably equipped MDX.

So, the budget conscious wife asks "I bet if we waited for the Honda it would have been less". Probably, and it would have satisfied all of our 'requirements', but we'd give up the crisp Acura styling and MDX exclusivity.:p I hope the supply is high on these - it'll be a hot seller, and will keep the MDX in the 'rare' status (this is a good thing!).
 

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Yes, it will be interesting to see if that Mantra does indeed work.
I know of three people (myself being one of them) who would NOT have bought the MDX if it was any larger. In my case, it just fits my garage by one inch of length now... And bigger would likely mean even worse gas mileage and range. So, while bigger may gain some prospects, it will likely loss some as well. The upcoming BMW X3 may find some takers in this latter (smaller-size, more-agile-oriented) group (smaller exterior size with actually more interior room than the X5, and at a 3 series price)... All these choices are what keeps it interesting!

wmquan said:
[While some may bemoan the lack of a smaller, sleeker vehicle, I think it's smart marketing in the U.S. Their target market covers a lot of young and growing families and the "bigger is better" mantra often works for those buyers. [/B]
 

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I recall back on Edmunds, in the first half of 2000, there was huge speculation on the size of the MDX, and all its other particulars. There were some who were tremendously disappointed with the final product.

Early MDX concepts looked to some buyers, as one put it, a sports-car-turned-SUV. (Not really a sports car in the true sense, but something more towards, but exceeding the X5.) The thought was that it wasn't particularly large, perhaps square in the mid-sized category or even a bit on the smaller side of mid-sized.

But as more pictures came out, the vehicle seemed bigger and bigger. Unfortunately they don't let you take a tape measure to the vehicle when it's previewed at car shows. When Acura finally announced the length of the vehicle, I remember me posting, "wow, she's a big one, isn't she?"

The size definitely put off some buyers, while it attracted others. After all, we've seen posts here and in other places that the MDX won't fit well into some garages, particularly without power folding mirrors.

For those who like the size, the MDX does indeed have the best cargo room in its class -- useable space behind the second row, and a small amount of useable space behind the third row. For myself, I've come to appreciate it more as I've packed a huge amount of baby gear into the back for that holiday trip to grandma's. This Xmas will be no different because while some newborn paraphernalia is gone, now we'll have to pack some safety gates to childproof the grandparents' house during our stay.

By the way, that particular poster on Edmunds who had initially hoped for sports-car-turned-SUV was tremendously disappointed, thinking it turned out to be a "slab-sided" family mobile. That said, he still liked the MDX as a vehicle, though his particular headroom requirements didn't make a good fit. He's still waiting for his sports-car-turned-SUV (he was hoping that the VW SUV will be that but early sketches are not attractive in that way).
 
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