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Discussion Starter #1
Click HERE to read it. Here's an interesting excerpt from one of the counterpoints:

The Pilot raises the same question as did last year's debut of the Toyota Highlander, priced almost $10,000 below the Lexus RX300: Does a luxury model lose luster when the blue-jean version arrives, offering the same basic guts for less? I say the RX300 doesn't really command the extra dollars. But there are still persuasive reasons to stretch from a Pilot to an MDX. The Acura can almost run down a BMW X5 3.0i on the road, whereas the Pilot feels noticeably porkier. Plus, the MDX's tangier styling makes the bland Pilot look like the byproduct of a Senate subcommittee on SUVs. If you have the extra money, spend it with my blessing.
(Link courtesy of ivtec at www.HondaCR-V.org
 

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GatorGreg said:
Here's an interesting excerpt from one of the counterpoints:[?B]
persuasive reasons to stretch from a Pilot to an MDX. The Acura can almost run down a BMW X5 3.0i on the road, whereas the Pilot feels noticeably porkier. Plus, the MDX's tangier styling makes the bland Pilot


Sounds like good news/bad news.

Good: Acknowledge Acura styling, handling & git

Bad: With the MDX already "almost running down" X5, odds on engine upgrade {maybe not so good} ???
 

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Price difference between a Pilot EX-L (leather) and a base MDX is $4,220.

Pilot Pricing:

LX $26,900
EX $29,270
EX-L $30,520
EX-L w/DVD Entertainment System $32,020
EX-L with Navi System $32,520

Destination is $460.
 

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wmquan said:
Price difference between a Pilot EX-L (leather) and a base MDX is $4,220.

and because the pilot is sooo hot these days, buyers might have to pay way over MSRP for it.... whereas since the demand for MDX might drop a little bit (hopefully not quite a bit), MSRP or lower is now possible on the MDX...

the bottom line, the difference might be even smaller than $4220...
 

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Thanks GatorGreg, for the

C & D review of the Pilot. The MDX comments put a big smile on my face... :D :D :D :D

Hope you and your CR-V are doing well.
 

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wmquan said:
Price difference between a Pilot EX-L (leather) and a base MDX is $4,220.
This isn't too bad. The difference is justified IMO by the styling and supposedly sportier handling, and the few extra features that you go get. The split does not make me have any regrets. That said, the Pilot (especially some of the lesser trim models) may be a better value. I think Honda/Acura did a pretty good job in keeping the price split reasonable.
 

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pilot's 3rd row seating

found this picture somewhere.... kind of hard to imagine the 3rd row can hold 3 adults.... but it does look wider than that from the MDX.... i remember reading some posts stating that pilot is acturally 2-3 inches wider (both inside and outside) than the MDX... you think MDX is hard to park? think again...:D
 

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Re: pilot's 3rd row seating

jj_mdx said:
i remember reading some posts stating that pilot is acturally 2-3 inches wider (both inside and outside) than the MDX... you think MDX is hard to park? think again...:D
See this page ...

http://www.acuramdx.org/forums/showthread.php?threadid=5088&perpage=15&pagenumber=5

The Pilot is only 0.3" wider and that's probably because of the mirrors.

There really is little more width in the Pilot's third row, according to the specs. Just a half-inch, but an inch more of legroom and more headroom.
 

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Interesting info on the Pilot. We're still debating whether to go with the X or Pilot. There is no way I'd pay over MSRP on the Pilot, especially when the difference would be less (between a "loaded" Pilot and a "base" X). The Honda dealer whose list I'm on assures me that I will pay MSRP on the Pilot; I doubt they're going to get much over MSRP anyway after the 1st few months. I'd like to at least check out the Pilot before I make a decision...however, I'm still looking for one of the last Granite Green X's.

Anyone know of any in their area??
 

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5 Star Front Crash Test

Excert from Car and Driver article:

"Considering all the standard comfort-and-convenience features, the Pilot may seem a tad light on passive safety gear: Only the front-seat occupants get front and side airbags, no curtain bags. Honda concentrated on structure, which pays off with five-star frontal and side-impact crash ratings".


I've been waiting to see the ratings for "frontal" crash tests on the X (although I know it's going to get rated high). The excerpt above indicates the Pilot already has a 5 star rating? How can that be?
 

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Re: Re: pilot's 3rd row seating

wmquan said:

The Pilot is only 0.3" wider and that's probably because of the mirrors.

There really is little more width in the Pilot's third row, according to the specs. Just a half-inch, but an inch more of legroom and more headroom.
i acturally looked closer at the pix i attached previously (trunk of pilot) and compared it with my mdx, and i found out where the increase in 3rd row seating comes from: take a look at your mdx trunk, there are two stripes next to the fold down 3rd row bench where 2 of the cargo hooks reside, each stripe is about 2 inches wide... now take a closer look at the trunck pix of the pilot, notice something missing? yeap, no space for hooks there, they just take away those two extra stripes and make the bench about 3-4 inches wider than the one in mdx.........;)

the increase in headroom comes from the re-shape of the trunk hatch/lid (more boxier there in the pilot), they might move the 3rd row bench a little bit back to get more leg room....

just my little .02....:D
 

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No special headrest storage either

The Honda doesn't have the nifty headrest "slot". Therefore the storage compartment is pushed all the way to the side also. More space, but you'll just have to throw your headrests in there. No wow factor... :D
 

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Justifying MDX over Honda

For me, getting the MDX was a combination of utility/styling/luxury. If I were to just look for utility, I'd get the Odyssey. Just for styling I'd get the X5. Just for luxury, the Lexus. But the MDX was what did it for me for all three aspects. The utility difference between Pilot and MDX are almost the same. However, styling is closer to the Odyssey than the X5. Luxury features are lacking as have been stated, moonroof, heated seats, non-column shifters, etc.

For me the MDX was the best fit and still is.

For those who don't care about styling and luxury as much, the Pilot is excellent.
 

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Re: No special headrest storage either

MDXtrous said:
The Honda doesn't have the nifty headrest "slot". Therefore the storage compartment is pushed all the way to the side also. More space, but you'll just have to throw your headrests in there. No wow factor... :D
Do you mean the storage compartment in the floor behind the third row seat? The Pilot has that, like the MDX. Or do you mean something else?
 

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Re: Re: Re: pilot's 3rd row seating

jj_mdx said:


i acturally looked closer at the pix i attached previously (trunk of pilot) and compared it with my mdx, and i found out where the increase in 3rd row seating comes from: take a look at your mdx trunk, there are two stripes next to the fold down 3rd row bench where 2 of the cargo hooks reside, each stripe is about 2 inches wide... now take a closer look at the trunck pix of the pilot, notice something missing? yeap, no space for hooks there, they just take away those two extra stripes and make the bench about 3-4 inches wider than the one in mdx.........;)

the increase in headroom comes from the re-shape of the trunk hatch/lid (more boxier there in the pilot), they might move the 3rd row bench a little bit back to get more leg room....

just my little .02....:D
I'm not sure if the stripes are really what makes the difference. The Pilot's specifications only has 0.5" more hiproom and 0.2" more shoulder room in the third row. See:

Front headroom of 41.9/40.9/38.9 vs. 38.7/39.0/36.3. Part of this is the lack of a moonroof, part of it is probably the more upright greenhouse of the vehicle (tall all the way to the back). This should help the taller folks out there.

Legroom of 41.4/37.4/30.2 vs. 41.5/37.8/29.3. Looks like Honda did squeeze 0.9" for the rear seat passengers, which is a pretty critical need. It's tight but like on an airplane, you want that extra inch. The second row got shortened by 0.4" to help out. I'll be the extra 0.4" for the third row came from some modification of seat thickness and whatnot.

Shoulder room of 61.6/61.4/58.8 vs. 61.2/61.1/58.6 is very similar to the MDX with a bit more in the front row. Could this just be the shape of the doors or something? Note that third seat passengers do not have much more shoulder room.

Hiproom of 57.5/56.6/49.0 vs. 56.9/56.3/48.5 shows some gains in the Pilot. 0.6" in the front, just 0.3" in the second row, and 0.5" in the third row.

Cargo capacity of 16.3/48.7/90.3 vs. ???/49.6/82.0 is interesting. The Pilot is the clear winner when the second and third rows are folded down, but the MDX actually has a tiny bit more space with just the third row folded down. Though the Pilot's taller back means some more odd-shaped items can go in the back.

All in all, the dimensions are similar to the MDX with some significant differences. Unfortunately the third row is not really much bigger to get 8 passengers, since it was already tight. Honda basically added a center seatbelt and headrest. Though it should be okay for smaller children, three across is going to be a squeeze.
As you said, the higher back roofline of the Pilot provides more headroom. The lack of a moonroof helps forward headroom a ton.
 

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I still love the MDX

Even if I had the option to go back and purchase a Pilot and save money, I still would choose the MDX. Much more class and better interior. The Pilot is perfect for a Honda type person. It's hard to put an exact description of a honda person, but it would be someone who would want to save a little to get similar. An acura customer would rather pay a little extra and something unique and to his or her liking. I believe the MDX is much more unique and less common like which I'm sure the Pilot will become. The only positive aspect to us acura people will hopefully be better availablilty and no more over msrp on the pricing. Maybe the salespeople will drop the attitude they have been having in past.
 

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Re: 5 Star Front Crash Test

DonsMDX said:
Excert from Car and Driver article:

"Considering all the standard comfort-and-convenience features, the Pilot may seem a tad light on passive safety gear: Only the front-seat occupants get front and side airbags, no curtain bags. Honda concentrated on structure, which pays off with five-star frontal and side-impact crash ratings".


I've been waiting to see the ratings for "frontal" crash tests on the X (although I know it's going to get rated high). The excerpt above indicates the Pilot already has a 5 star rating? How can that be?
Good question!

It just means that Honda has extensively crash-tested the Pilot (and the MDX) internally, and is thus confident it will earn the 5-star rating in the NHTSA full-frontal crash test. The NHTSA has not yet tested the Pilot. I believe they've tested the MDX by now and will release the results within the next few months (they've already tested it for side impact).

I don't see any reason to doubt Honda on the claim. They have invested a lot of money (to be passed on to customers, of course) to build a huge indoor crash testing facility in Japan (largest indoor in the world at the time it was built). That investment lets them make such a bold statement without having egg on their face. Thus far, all their recent vehicles have done well.

However, if someone needs final proof ("it ain't over 'till it's over"), it'll probably be at least several months before Pilot NHTSA results are out, if not longer.
 

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Discussion Starter #18
wmquan said:
Thus far, all their recent vehicles have done well.
Yep, in fact if I'm not mistaken the 2nd gen 'V is the FIRST SUV ever tested to achieve perfect 5 star ratings in each of the four NHTSA crash test categories (frontal crash driver & passenger, side crash front seat & rear seat). I'm sure William will correct me if my assertion is incorrect :p For details on the outstanding test results of the 2nd gen 'V, click HERE
Originally posted by VA Tech Hokie
Thanks GatorGreg, for the
C & D review of the Pilot. The MDX comments put a big smile on my face... :D :D :D :D

Hope you and your CR-V are doing well.
Thanks Hokie, all is well here in CR-V Land, still in the honeymoon phase :p Be sure to stop by www.HondaCR-V.org sometime and say hello.
 

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GatorGreg said:

Yep, in fact if I'm not mistaken the 2nd gen 'V is the FIRST SUV ever tested to achieve perfect 5 star ratings in each of the four NHTSA crash test categories (frontal crash driver & passenger, side crash front seat & rear seat). I'm sure William will correct me if my assertion is incorrect :
No, I believe you're correct. Certainly from the technical side. Morally, there's a bit of an asterisk to it because NHTSA does not always front-and-side crash test all SUV's, nor does NHTSA adhere to any schedule. E.g. the MDX will probably also be 5/5/5/5 and was out before the new CR-V, but NHTSA hasn't tested it yet.

But that's to take nothing away from the CR-V, it really did well in the test, as expected (the new Civic also does very well; the additional height of the CR-V and perhaps some reinforcing helps it better the Civic's NHTSA side-impact scores).
 

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Discussion Starter #20
Originally posted by wmquan E.g. the MDX will probably also be 5/5/5/5 and was out before the new CR-V, but NHTSA hasn't tested it yet.
It has been tested for side impact and received 5 stars for both front and rear seats, but you're right, it still says "TBT" (which I assume means "to be tested") for the frontal crash tests. I also expect the 'X will get 5 stars for both front crash test categories based on Honda's predictions. However, it is apparently MUCH more difficult to get perfect scores for the front crash tests than the side crash tests.

For example, the RX300, Rendezvous, 4Runner, RAV4, Tribute, Escape, Blazer (not to be confused with Trailblazer), and Liberty (all 2002 models) all received 5 stars for side crash test front and rear seats. However, each one of them failed to receive 5 stars in one or both of the frontal crash test categories. In fact, the only SUVs tested (besides the CR-V) to receive 5 stars in both front crash test categories were the 2002 Navigator 4x4 and 2002 Expedition 4x4, but neither has been side crash tested yet.

So assuming the MDX eventually succeeds in getting 5 stars for the frontal crash test categories in addition to the perfect scores it has already received for the side crash tests, it will be quite an accomplishment IMO. Of course, like the CR-V, it could still use stability control, side curtain airbags, rear seat airbags, ceiling airbags, foot airbags, and ejection seats too :p
 
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