So the SH AWD on pilot and MDX are the same? - Acura MDX Forum : Acura MDX SUV Forums
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post #1 of 21 (permalink) Old 01-18-2016, 09:53 AM Thread Starter
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So the SH AWD on pilot and MDX are the same?

Just came across this nice article about Different types of SH AWD.It looks like the Honda Pilot and the 2016 MDX have the same AWD system.

A great read for someone interested.The new MDX now seems even more unappealing for my needs now.

Acura SH-AWD: A Comprehensive Analysis (Updated Jan.8, 2016) - YouWheel.com - Car News and Review

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post #2 of 21 (permalink) Old 01-18-2016, 10:19 AM
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It sounded like the Honda and MDX systems are identical with the only difference is programing for TQ vectoring? It still sounds like the 16 MDX sh-awd system is an (slight) improvement from the previous Pre-16 MDX versions (overdrive ratio, lighter weight, less engine loss to engage). The Honda Pilot is the one that got the huge boost in performance of the awd system.

The sad part about this is we are getting way overcharged for the MDX $2000 premium for sh-awd since manufacturing cost is now being spread across the Honda line-up also.

What do you get with the 16 MDX compared to the Pilot other than a different body style?

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post #3 of 21 (permalink) Old 01-18-2016, 11:00 AM
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Well you get a better safety rating and lower price around here. New pilot Elite goes for MSRP if you are lucky due to the waiting list.

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post #4 of 21 (permalink) Old 01-18-2016, 02:22 PM
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Thank you for this article! I've seen the SAE paper summary but haven't read it (didn't want to pay for it lol), and didn't realize that the 16 SH-AWD and 16 VTM-4 were identical until last week when I was analyzing part diagrams of both. Then it made me wonder if the new 16+ SH-AWD was actually as capable as the old one, but it looks like it potentially can be (I say potentially because like the blog has mentioned, torque vectoring can be omitted, and I haven't seen too many off-road reviews). Better though? That is still a question mark. I know for one that the rear differential fluid changes are much more critical to keep up now, which means that used vehicle owners should be cautious. I'm used to that with my Subaru anyway, so not much of a problem IMO for me, but I'm the DIY kind of owner also.

Here's some offroading done in the 16 by Redline Reviews btw: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m6w3Bo7_wus

It gives you some idea of the abilities of the new SH-AWD, seems quite capable.

Here's the 16 Pilot VTM-4: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q9ewC2dde3E
You will notice that it is a Honda prepared track and also how the VTM-4 seems quite reactionary. The Honda rep also compared it to the Acura SH-AWD's torque vectoring, which he implied the new VTM-4 doesn't have in NORMAL mode, but does have in say, sand mode. So, does that mean the 16+ SH-AWD is more like VTM-4 sand mode all the time?

Well, either way, I'm sure it's much more of a value issue now with the 16+ MDX vs the 16+ Pilot. As time goes on, the dealers will hopefully be less stubborn on holding MSRP on the Pilot and the MDX will need to really improve quite a bit to differentiate itself from the Pilot. Honda sales folk may eventually catch on too, advertising that the VTM-4 is identical to the SH-AWD, which will dilute the value of the MDX further.

Another vid but more of a comparo between the 16 Pilot and 16 Highlander: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0mu9Ie5FF1M
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post #5 of 21 (permalink) Old 01-18-2016, 03:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cukoodukoo View Post
Just came across this nice article about Different types of SH AWD.It looks like the Honda Pilot and the 2016 MDX have the same AWD system.

A great read for someone interested.The new MDX now seems even more unappealing for my needs now.

Acura SH-AWD: A Comprehensive Analysis (Updated Jan.8, 2016) - YouWheel.com - Car News and Review
good read. thanks for the link

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post #6 of 21 (permalink) Old 01-19-2016, 12:59 PM
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Yup, they are the same. They quietly changed the SH-AWD from 2015 to 2016 most likely to consolidate the Honda and Acura systems for cost benefits (to them, not us).

Thanks for the article. Makes a good read.
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post #7 of 21 (permalink) Old 01-19-2016, 01:11 PM
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Might be the same system for the all new Ridgeline. I don't know if Honda will ever make an awd Odyssey; but, probably the same system.

Acura is starting to become a trim level like Chevy/Buick/GMC/Caddy or Ford/Mercury/Lincoln.

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post #8 of 21 (permalink) Old 01-19-2016, 01:33 PM
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Originally Posted by mrgold35 View Post
Might be the same system for the all new Ridgeline. I don't know if Honda will ever make an awd Odyssey; but, probably the same system.

Acura is starting to become a trim level like Chevy/Buick/GMC/Caddy or Ford/Mercury/Lincoln.
sounds about right.

shoot. all three vehicles might be using the same uni-body to costs?
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post #9 of 21 (permalink) Old 01-19-2016, 02:11 PM
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From all that analysis I came up with these points for SH-AWD 3.0 Gen system:

PROS:
1.- Better overdrive (Though still not as good as the RL but better than gen 2.0)
2.- Lightweight
3.- Less performance hit

CONS:
1.- Wearable Parts (As in the drive unit ala VTM4 ish)
2.- More time to kick in (Since there is no physical drive)
3.- Hydraulic Engaged Clutch? Nope.. Nope nope nope nope...

IMHO they could have done an upgrade to SH-AWD 2.0 and keep the physical link (direct drive) with better materials and the new overdrive ratio, Since gen 2.0 only uses the Magnetic Clutches for the Overdrive and not to drive the car the gen 2.0 will surely outlast the 3.0.. I dont know how many people will keep the car that long though.. But since the MPGs wars are at the peak these days it was logical to favor a lighter system that will improve MPGs and also reduce engine load for better performance.

I for one will like the system to be called for what it is..
"Hybrid VTM4" because the only remaining aspect of SH-AWD is the Overdrive for Torque Vectoring, Honda can easily install the new SH-AWD in the Pilot with no issues.

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post #10 of 21 (permalink) Old 01-20-2016, 12:55 AM
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One thing the 3rd gen MDX has over the Pilot is a lack of an oddly low seating position for the front seats...Pilot's riding position looks awkward and like the roof is oddly high...that and the MDX has better weight distro still with a lower COG. My understanding was that the SH-AWD still had some different handling algorithms over what the VTM4 has despite using the same parts.

I'm still happy with my '16 MDX and I expect many years of faithful service out of it...it's true test will be my move to Anchorage, AK this spring and we'll see how it fairs in an Alaska winter! :O

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post #11 of 21 (permalink) Old 01-20-2016, 03:13 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cukoodukoo View Post
Just came across this nice article about Different types of SH AWD.It looks like the Honda Pilot and the 2016 MDX have the same AWD system.

A great read for someone interested.The new MDX now seems even more unappealing for my needs now.

Acura SH-AWD: A Comprehensive Analysis (Updated Jan.8, 2016) - YouWheel.com - Car News and Review
Cukhold. It looks like the MDX is in for a world or hurt. I predict cannibalization from the Pilot. Sales will crash and incentives will be plenty!

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post #12 of 21 (permalink) Old 01-20-2016, 03:43 AM
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You'll find plenty of Pilots in Alaska.
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post #13 of 21 (permalink) Old 01-20-2016, 09:54 AM
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Originally Posted by boston View Post
You'll find plenty of Pilots in Alaska.
This might be the reason I would pick a Honda Pilot over a MDX in Alaska. Not sure how Honda would handle warranty work if I'm 800 miles from the closest Acura dealership?

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post #14 of 21 (permalink) Old 01-20-2016, 10:42 AM
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Originally Posted by mrgold35 View Post
This might be the reason I would pick a Honda Pilot over a MDX in Alaska. Not sure how Honda would handle warranty work if I'm 800 miles from the closest Acura dealership?
All warranty work on an Acura can be performed at a Honda dealer if you are more than 100 miles from the nearest Acura store. That being said, the dealer in Anchorage is Continental Honda/Acura so no probs there

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post #15 of 21 (permalink) Old 01-20-2016, 03:01 PM
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Build quality of Pilots has been improving after a terrible start.
I think 16 Pilots will get marked down by the trade as the ones to avoid.
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